Pneuma Conversations

WTW 2022
3 June
Pneuma Conversations

We join these conversations in progress….

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~eny
Reading late 19th century testimony in a book titled Radiant Glory. I’m in cap. xi.

It hit me in cap viii that was a decade before Azusa so just now I thought to consider the first beginnings of the modern rediscovery of the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Here is an indication this restoration began as early at the 18th century.

“Many Puritans believed that the conversion experience was followed by a later and distinct experience of the Holy Spirit. This experience was characterized by receiving assurance of one’s salvation. English Puritan Thomas Goodwin equated this experience with the baptism in the Holy Spirit and the “seal of the Spirit” referenced in Ephesians 1.”[34]

“John Fletcher, Wesley’s designated successor, called Christian perfection a “baptism in the Holy Spirit”.[1][38] On the subject, Fletcher wrote:

Lastly: if we will attain the full power of godliness, and be peaceable as the Prince of Peace, and merciful as our heavenly Father, let us go on to the perfection and glory of Christianity; let us enter the full dispensation of the Spirit. Till we live in the pentecostal glory of the Church: till we are baptized with the Holy Ghost: till the Spirit of burning and the fire of Divine love have melted us down, and we have been truly cast into the softest mould of the Gospel: till we can say with St. Paul, “We have received the Spirit of love, of power, and of a sound mind;” till then we shall be carnal rather than spiritual believers.[39]

~end
And all of that for the A/G.

~eny
This was all way before the assemblies

I never knew about anything pentecostal before 1900 and after Maximilla & Priscilla except for a couple obscure medieval instances. Did you know about the Spirit baptism connection building from the 18th century Puritans through Wesley and the Methodists and 19th century holiness leading up to but before Azusa?

…

Also, look at the history section here
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaking_in_tongues

…

And now this… wow… the untold backstory of modern pentecostalism
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Fox_Parham

~end
How focused are you on HG baptism, and what about initial physical evidence? Is that Scripture?

~eny
The whole counsel is a treasure load far exceeding the tiny segments most consider daily

I long to know Him in the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His suffering

I see all these things so plainly and boldly presented to us in scripture with NONE of the modern day divisions

So as always it remains
Both/and
Never
Either/or
In regard to the narrow way of life abundant

My focus is abundantly on the WORD with a strong interest in history and currently Islam, now yesterday and today finding a new area of significance in the development of the modern holiness movements in the times from 1600-1900…I never knew these things

On the initial physical evidence question…I do not share that phrase because I always point to the boldness of speaking the WORD

Note in the initial tongues… the focus is often on the tongues yet this is looking at the surface of things…we do not look at the surface of things… what we do is recognize the the message is not of talk but of power… so what we see is that what happened in the initial instance was… they all heard them DECLARING THE WONDROUS WORKS OF GOD each in their own tongue. The message, the evangel is not mere talk. The message is the CONTENT.

That being said, an honest reading of Acts does find that even 25 years later the indication, the seal certifying God’s approval on the non Jews and indeed certifying salvation and new creations was water baptism and spirit baptism and like you said before fire baptism

~end
Then many ask yet do not receive this gift